Episode 3: The First 24 Hours

In this raw and emotional episode of Love Survives Grief, Stephanie and Shaun revisit the first morning they woke up to a reality they never wanted—a reality where their son was gone and the world expected answers. Before they had time to process what had happened, they were suddenly faced with an overwhelming list of choices: funeral homes, burial or cremation, service details, paperwork, death certificates, finances, clothing, flowers, and countless questions that no parent should ever have to answer while living through the worst day of their lives.

As they reflect on those early hours, they ask a difficult but important question: Why are grieving families forced to make so many life-altering decisions so quickly? Is the current system designed to help families, or has it become a process driven by timelines, business needs, and logistics rather than human compassion?

Stephanie and Shaun share what it felt like to make permanent decisions while operating in a fog of shock and trauma. They discuss the choices they wish they had more time to consider, the pressure they felt from well-meaning professionals, and the reality that many grieving parents aren't capable of fully understanding the consequences of their decisions in those first few days.

This episode opens a conversation about what it would look like if grieving families were given more time, more guidance, and more grace? How can hospitals, funeral homes, and support systems better serve families whose worlds have just been shattered?

If you've ever felt rushed through grief, struggled with decisions made during the darkest days of your life, or wondered how we can better support bereaved families, this conversation will resonate deeply.

Because sometimes the greatest act of compassion isn't asking families to decide—it's giving them permission to simply grieve.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Welcome back to Love Survives Grief. I'm Sean.

SPEAKER_01 0:05

I'm Stephanie.

SPEAKER_00 0:07

Thanks for tuning in again. This is our third episode. Today we are going to be talking about the days, the weeks, the months after we lost our son Cash.

SPEAKER_01 0:18

Yeah, last time was very emotional, very hard. Not that like we don't ever replay that day. I mean, I don't know for you, but like it frequently replays in my mind, but then like you don't typically talk about it after the first little bit. It replays in your mind, but you don't really vocalize it. You know, so going back and like vocalizing all of that. And I had said afterwards, I don't know that you and I have ever talked like minute by minute about that day to each other.

SPEAKER_00 0:54

No, just certain aspects of it the entire day. Right. From start to finish.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

And that was heavy. And I don't know that we ever have. And I think a lot of that was me protecting you because I knew how hard it was on you because you were the one that found Cash that grabbed him from his bed. So I knew how hard that was, and I never I also didn't need those details, I guess. Like I didn't need to know what it was like, what he looked like, you know, like I didn't need all of that because it wasn't gonna change the outcome.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

Correct. So we lived it once, we didn't need to relive it. Even though we do relive it, everything in our minds, in our minds, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:37

And I think two other people are so uncomfortable with it, which is a huge part of this, right? Correct.

SPEAKER_00 1:46

Yeah, I've had people at work that I brought it up and they won't even acknowledge it. They'll just completely shut down and change the subject.

SPEAKER_01 1:54

Yeah. But yeah, people will be like, How many kids do you have? And I'm like, Oh, I have three. Oh, what are their ages? Yeah. Oh, you know, 14, 11, and then our youngest passed away at seven months, and it's like, okay, gotta go.

unknown 2:06

Yeah, that's pretty awkward.

SPEAKER_01 2:08

I'm like, wait, what? You know. So, but anyways, that's a whole nother a whole nother topic. But we can go back to I guess now that next morning. So November 17th, our son passed away at seven months. Um, it was one of the hardest things I've ever gone through. Still is one of the hardest things that I'm constantly going through. And not just me, but our family, obviously. It altered everything. Um, and now all of a sudden it's November 18th, 2019. And I just remember waking up, but not really ever sleeping, but waking up like moving now, right? Like I'm up off the couch. I had mentioned last time, like I stayed on the couch with my sister. I never went back into our bedroom, I couldn't do it. Um, you had slept upstairs with the kids, and now it was that next morning, and it was almost that holy crap, that was real. Yeah, shock, but also just survival mode, and then just a bunch of lists of what you said the flood of everything now that had to get done. Everything from excusing our oldest from school, because it was like obviously he's not going to school, you know. Um, which that phone call was one of the first times, other than like my family, that I had said it out loud, like my son just passed away. And you know, I I work at the school now that he did go to, and I work with the secretary who answered the phone call um when I had to make that, and that was so hard to have to like spit those words out again that morning. And for me, it was like, oh my gosh, this is real! Like, this is my reality. This is how I have to start these phone calls now, explaining why things are gonna look different, you know. But and then it was just list after list, decision after decision.

SPEAKER_00 4:17

It was a lot, it was overwhelming. Yeah, I think you didn't want it to be real, like you've you felt like you were in a dream state, even though it was real, but you didn't want to believe that it was real, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:28

And I don't think, and I think this was a huge society problem. We don't allow the proper time to mourn and to accept it. I mean, it wasn't even 24 hours later, and we had people calling my phone constantly, and by people I mean these good natured. I mean, I don't really know looking back how they got our information. I I guess like the morgues all want your business, like how morbid is that?

SPEAKER_00 5:01

Yeah, they might be listening to 911 calls or something.

SPEAKER_01 5:04

Yeah, and they just constantly were calling, and it was like, okay, my baby passed away not even 24 hours ago. Like, leave me alone. And I finally, I don't know if you remember the um, I don't think it was the medical examiner's office. Maybe it was, but they kept calling because they wanted to know if we would donate any of his organs. And you know, I do have to say those families that are able to make those that decision to do it, they for me are held to such a high standard and like high up on a pedestal. Because when they called and asked, and they left voicemail after voicemail because it got to the point where we weren't answering our phone anymore. Like we were being bombarded, which is just such an issue. Like, we have got to figure out a way to let families be, you know, and let them take things. And keep in mind, we had my sister and your parents fielding calls already. They were, you know, these are I'm talking about the calls that got through them that were still coming to our phones, that were still being bombarded. Then people were coming to our door, and I was like, oh my gosh, like leave us alone. Um, but when they were calling and asking, and I'll never forget them asking if we had considered donating his eyes, and that was so hard for me because one of the things that stands out the most when I look back at Cash's pictures are his eyes, and he had this like one of my old coworkers said it perfectly. He had flirty eyes from a young age, he just had that twinkle in his eye. They always glistened, they were, he just had smiley eyes. And when they were asking that, I was so irritated and I lost it on that poor person who, you know, it's it's their job. They don't want to make that phone call either. Like you do looking back, removed from that overall emotion, you feel terrible for the person that has to make that call. Like, that's the last thing they want to be doing. And then there's this pivotal window of time that they can harvest things or you know, certain things that they can use. And I was just like, no, if it wasn't, and I said this to the person on the phone, if it wasn't good enough for him to have on earth, it's not good enough for somebody else. And I know that's selfish. I know that's selfish. And I look at the families who can donate organs and who see the other side of it in their darkest time and they think, how can they better it? And that's why I say, like, I respect them so much because I was not there mentally, and I think it's okay not to be. I think it's okay that I wanted my baby to be buried with all of his things.

unknown 8:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:18

You know, I I think it's okay that families donate their or I think both of those are okay, and I I don't like the stigma that is around it for either of them. I did feel very judged by not giving of different things that they were asking for, but I mean it was my worst moments. How am I supposed to make a decision?

SPEAKER_00 8:42

It was, yeah. It was they wanted it so fast, it happened so fast, everything. The decisions, the just moving forward. I remember you and Beth, your sister primarily being the ones that made the decisions, and I was just helping distract uh Lincoln and Brentley. Yeah. Just kind of being there for them and just try to be a distraction.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

Which looking and your parents were huge in, you know, your dad was really great at getting the kids out and doing things. Yeah. Your dad and you are very similar to where you can't sit and be still, anyways. And you know, he because your parents got there the next morning. They drove from California. They got there the next morning, they were there. Um, and your sister was with them. And they kind of went straight into that. Okay, our job is to keep the kids busy. It's to keep Lincoln and Brindley busy.

SPEAKER_00 9:36

To be grandparents, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:38

Yeah, for sure. And you know, my sister and my brother-in-law, they knew in those moments their job was to be my stand-in mom, my stand-in parent. And they were, oh my goodness, they had to make all of those hard decisions with us, you know. They were with us for for all of it. Um, and I think my brother-in-law actually ended up having to leave early, and I think just being thrown into all of that was just too much for him because they still had their three boys at home. And how do you parent them while, you know, you're dealing with your little sister? Because I've known him since I was, you know, 11, 12 years old. You're trying to do do both things, and it just became too much for him. So he ended up leaving early. Um, and my sister stayed um out and everything. He didn't leave until everything was like set, but you know, let's talk about those decisions that you're just faced with making when we walk into that um mortuary, yeah, which was not the next day.

SPEAKER_00 10:51

No, it probably wasn't.

SPEAKER_01 10:53

I will say family allowed us to just be that day.

SPEAKER_00 10:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:57

They really did. Family did. I mean, they were fielding calls for us. We had the medical people, you know, on that side bombarding us, and that, like I said, we've got to figure out a way to let families be. Um but that day was mostly, I think, just the reality hitting.

unknown 11:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

And and you know, I remember like because we were doing laundry the day before, and so now I'm trying to fold this laundry because I'm trying to stay busy, which the downside to that is people want you to just sit, but I need to be busy because I don't want to face the reality. So I'm trying to fold laundry, and then you know, you get a pair of his socks or you get pants, or you know, you get those those little things, yeah, all through and stuff. And um so the next day, I think it was Tuesday, is when we my sister had found the mortuary already.

SPEAKER_00 11:57

It was really close to our house. Yes, it was.

SPEAKER_01 11:59

Yeah, like I mean, we probably drove by it every day. I went to work, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:02

Maybe a mile and a half. Yeah. I don't even think it was two miles.

SPEAKER_01 12:06

I mean, I never paid attention to it, although I drove by it all the time. I never really paid attention, other than like, oh, like it's a really pretty build building, you know, very spacious, like green grass, you know, like it was a beautiful building. Um, but she had gone in and checked it out already. And we we now had to go as mom and dad.

unknown 12:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:28

And you know, you walk in and you they're in this world. Well, first of all, the guy that we were with, which to those people again, saints.

SPEAKER_00 12:38

That's a hard job, especially.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

That's a very hard job, especially when young parents come in.

SPEAKER_00 12:42

Yeah, and it's a baby, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:44

Very hard job.

SPEAKER_00 12:46

Um, and you could tell they didn't know how to act around us, they felt uncomfortable as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:51

Yeah. And the one guy we had was terrible.

SPEAKER_00 12:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:55

He was so stoned. I mean, I like I remember him talking about when we were deciding. Well, we had decided, I guess, right before that we were going to Barry Cash in California with my dad. That was home. California was always home. Absolutely. Um so it was never really up for debate, I guess. Like I wanted him by my dad. Like, if he couldn't be with me, the next best thing was to be by my dad. Like, that's kind of how I, you know, compartmentalized that, I guess. Um, but that worker guy, can't I can't even remember his name because he was so terrible though. He was so cold.

SPEAKER_00 13:33

He took it, he couldn't have any empathy for us. He I I feel like he wasn't able to put his himself in our shoes and try to understand what we're going through. And it was the approach he took was just like a salesperson. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:47

It was just it was here's my job, make this decision, XYZ, and it and then just bombarded Where's your card?

SPEAKER_00 13:54

Bombarded with paperwork. Yeah. That's all I just remember being in that little room office. Yeah. And he's sitting behind the desk, and me, you, and your sister are sitting on the other side of the house.

SPEAKER_01 14:05

Yeah, all four of us are there.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

Yeah. And it felt like we were buying a home or something, or buying a car. It really did. It's just paperwork after paperwork after paperwork.

SPEAKER_01 14:13

Well, and he was like, he was. He was trying to upsell caskets. And oh, but this one, and and his tone was you could tell when he would talk about like a pricier one, like, hey, look at this one has this bells and whistles, and I'm sitting there and I'm like, you have I I think I finally snapped at him. It might have been when he had left the room and I snapped at you three, but I was like, he's gotta stop. Like, you're selling a parent their baby's casket.

SPEAKER_00 14:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:46

Like if there's no bells and whistles. There's nothing amazing about this right now. No casket should be that small, or heaven forbid, smaller. Like, no casket. And I remember him talking about do you want one that opens one, like one um hinge, you know, like the whole thing would be open, or do you want the two, like the split? Do you want and and he's like, oh, I can show you different models. And I'm like, I don't need to see models of baby caskets. Like, I'm not here for I don't even want to be here, period. And now you're like, we can look at this baby one, and we can look at this baby. Like, it just was insane. And I'm like, maybe some people that is comforting for, and you know, I don't want to sound rude. Maybe that is comforting for them. But at the same time, can we not just have a package where it's like, I'm so sorry, this is your worst day of your life right now. We've already gotten all of this taken care of. Don't worry about anything. Don't you don't have to sign your life away. You don't have to you we've got to. Like, why is that not a thing?

SPEAKER_00 15:59

Yeah, unreal.

SPEAKER_01 16:00

Because I can't tell you. I mean, he wanted all these decisions, yeah, and I can't tell you what we were saying. I I'm like, I don't know. I don't even know how I put shoes on and got here. Yeah, it was all a blur for thankfully our family was there to drive us, like, because I could not, it was down the road and around one corner from our house.

SPEAKER_00 16:19

Yeah, one stop sign, one one stop light. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:22

I could not have gotten there.

unknown 16:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:24

Like, and now you want me to decide what color liner and a cast, what kind of pillow I want him, like what? I want him on me. That's what I want. Like, oh, that was so, so terrible. And then when he was talking about, because we had mentioned, like, you know, we were in Utah when he passed away. Um, we were burying him in California, so we had to get him to California. Um, and the call I think this is where I snapped at him when he started talking about, well, he would just be in a box and we would have him in the box, and I find like it's not a box, like, stop saying that. Yeah. And he was so shocked that we weren't okay with his terminology. And like it was really bad. And I do feel like most of the people aren't like that. We finally did have to say something to correct to the managers and stuff there. Like, we specifically asked for him not to be the one that did Cash's viewing and stuff because he was so terrible.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

Like I said earlier, it's he just could not get himself to put himself in our shoes. Like mentally, he couldn't go there.

SPEAKER_01 17:33

Which I'm like, then maybe that's not the line of work for you. Because I do think you have to be a very empathetic person to be there, you know. I mean, yes, it is. I understand it's still a business. I get that. They're making money off of somebody's worst day. Like, that's a crappy business model, period. But you still have to be human and you have to be empathetic. And especially when somebody's coming in. We talk about the circle of life. I expect to bury my grandparents, I expect to bury my parents. You don't ever expect to bury your baby, like, you know, so when somebody like that is coming through, when a situation like that is coming through, you've gotta be human and you've gotta show some empathy. And he just he couldn't do it. Um but the I think Jason was the phenomenal guy. Yeah, he was he was phenomenal, and I could tell he was a dad. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:25

And he acted to me, I felt like he acted more like he treated us like family, like he was my brother-in-law or an uncle or something. Like he took that approach. Yeah, he was very soft, gentle.

SPEAKER_01 18:40

Who was the original one that my sister had met with?

SPEAKER_00 18:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:43

That she, you know, was like he's gonna take great care and stuff. So then when we're sitting in the room with this other guy, like I said, I can't remember his name, super different. Like, wait a second, this is not at all the vibe we got, um, or anything, you know, like that. And I just didn't know how many you talked about like just paper after paper, signing, signing, signing. How many things there were. Yeah, you know, you you know a casket, but then there's like I said, there's a liner inside the casket that apparently has colors. And then on that you have pillows that are design, or they have ruffles, or they're plain, or they're, you know, how thick, how high up do you want?

SPEAKER_00 19:26

Like, there are so many different options, which I'm like decisions to make that you're not ready or want to make those decisions, right? And then on top of that, too, there was the legal side of it all. There was the death certificate, there was the health stuff.

SPEAKER_01 19:44

And we had to do double because we were transferring out of state.

SPEAKER_00 19:46

Yeah. So there was all the health stuff with the metal the morgue and the metal examiner.

SPEAKER_01 19:51

Uh-huh. So and releasing him, and who were we releasing to, and his he always had to have somebody with him because of body and because a baby. And so he always had to have um not what like a guard, but that's not what they called it.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

Escort.

SPEAKER_01 20:09

Yeah, there we go. Um, you know, the entire time, like so many sides of it that you just you just don't know. Why should you ever know? But I'm I just sit there now looking back and I'm like, you know, even when it comes to us when we die and stuff, like, I don't need a fancy thing. Like, at the end of the day, it's still a casket. Like, why are we making this? And you can't tell me that it's not a money grab. You can't tell me that.

SPEAKER_00 20:38

It's definitely a business for sure.

SPEAKER_01 20:40

And you know, because everything was well, here's standard, but you can go and you can get this. And of course they mentioned that, and of course they have that circled, and that they're gonna emphasize, you know.

SPEAKER_00 20:52

And I'm just like Yeah, there was pamphlet after pamphlet, books with different options, and handles, and which handle do you want? And so it was like I really felt like we were buying a custom building, like a custom home, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:05

It was horrible, and how terrible that what we were custom making was our son's casket. Yeah, it was a home for his body, yeah. And then it was um the you know, his outfit and stuff, and we like I did in those moments. I I was mom and I was like, okay, I knew what he was going to wear. He was gonna wear his Christmas outfit that he never got to wear. Um, and so I knew that. And so then it was okay, like his liner's gonna be plain because his bow tie was a maroon and um cream polka dot. So his liner's gonna be polka dot, and you know, I want his hair to look like that. Like, and I I felt like I was getting him ready for a wedding or for prom. And I'm getting him ready for his casket, and that's so terrible. And how do we help parents through that? I I'm not really sure because it is so. So terrible, you know, and but you want it perfect as a parent, and I am a perfectionist, I will admit that. Um I just and I knew that our that our older kids were gonna see him too, and I knew that I needed him to look like he was himself the most that I could, you know. Um, because we we had made the decision to do a viewing in Utah.

SPEAKER_00 22:29

Yeah. That's before sending them to California.

SPEAKER_01 22:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:33

Where he was gonna be buried. But let me go back real quick. You asked a question, how do we help parents through that process? You had a coworker that had been through something very similar. Yes. So explain maybe how she helped you through that.

SPEAKER_01 22:47

She did, she became so I I knew that she had lost a son. You know, I hope that we can have her come on and talk about her experience because she really still to this day has been a mentor for me through all of this. Um, but she had lost her baby. Very different. She knew ahead of time that he was not going to be getting. Um, yeah, I think he was like three months, maybe four, but baby, baby. Um, and she had come over that following morning. Um, one of my coworkers had called obviously all everyone to let them know. And she was one that they had personally reached out to, knowing that she had been through the death of a baby. And so she did. She came over and she, you know, just sat with me on the couch for hours. And she was actually the one that told me, which I had never thought of before. Um, when my dad passed away, they told my brother not to dress his body because he had had to have an autopsy. And they, you know, were like, you're not gonna want to see that, and things. My family, my dad was very religious. Um, and so in the Mormon culture, you do have to have somebody that is, I they call it endowed, um, dress the body. And the funeral home that we had worked through with my dad was, and so my brother didn't have to do that. So, and the reason I bring that up is because that was the only other time that I had, you know, any idea of burying or of dressing a body. Um, so my coworker, her name's Lindsay, she's sitting on it and she's, you know, talking, and I'm and she's letting me know you're going to have all these decisions coming your way. Um, this was Monday, the day after. You're gonna have to start making these. And she, I'll never forget sitting on that couch, and she looked at me and she said, They're going to ask you if you want to dress his body. And your mom's side of you is gonna want to say yes because he's your baby, but she was like, Don't do it. And I was like, What? Like, and I and I was kind of shocked by that. Um, and I'm not gonna go into details of what she explained, but she had, you know, um dressed her baby, and she said that she wished she wouldn't have. Um Cash had an autopsy. I mean, she had that why why incision. We would have seen that. I don't, I don't need to see that, you know. Um, you think back to when the detective was like, you don't want to see your baby in this. Now somehow it's worse, right? Um, and so she just had had kind of walked me through those things, and she was like, You're not gonna want to see him that way when you know you hold him, and she talked about a few different things. Now, again, I don't mean that any shame to parents, any judgment for parents who have dressed their babies, very different situations. Everyone handles things differently. I, as she talked about it, knew I mentally could not handle that. Um, I am just kind of now realizing like I never even gave you the option. Yeah, it was just uh no, we're not going to do it. Yeah. And we handed all of his clothes over. I mean, down to a diaper, right? Because I was like, yo, he needs a diaper, he needs his socks, he needs his shoes, he needs, I handed them his hair gel, like he needed all of his stuff, you know. You guys dress him. Here's a picture of what we want him to look like.

unknown 26:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

Um, but no, she she really was. Lindsay was phenomenal in in helping me through those things. And like I said, even to this day, on you know, that especially that first year, it was with all the holidays coming up, with all those, it it was just those check-ins. And sometimes all it was was a heart emoji.

SPEAKER_00 26:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:39

And spoke volumes, right?

SPEAKER_00 26:41

Um, I never got to meet her husband. I wish I could have to have him kind of help me through the process. I was, I remember for months after Cash passed away, I was always jealous of the amount of support you got as a mother. But me as a father, there was no other man that wanted to come and talk to me that had experienced what we were experiencing.

SPEAKER_01 27:06

Yeah, and you you did look for a long time, and then of course, COVID happened. So even when we finally found a couple of things, they were they got shut down really fast, very quickly shut down, yeah. Um, no, she she really was, you know, and she told me as well. She was like, one day you're gonna be the mentor to somebody, and that was like, oh, how terrible of a thing, like to know that one day this is going to become helpful to somebody else. Like, my worst day is gonna become helpful to somebody else, you know, and and to be able to guide them through and to walk them through, and you know, just let them know like, hey, you're gonna have a lot of hard decisions, there's no right or wrong answer. Be kind to yourself, like, and that's really what she was just like be kind to yourself, you know. Our kids had um played together and stuff at at work, and so you know, they had somebody, both of them had somebody that they could lean on, yeah. Um, because they had lost obviously their baby brother, and you know, it just it's one of those like silver linings of like, okay, I'm so thankful I can lean on her, but like, gosh dang it, why does this have to happen? Babies aren't supposed to to do this, you know, and people would tell us that all the time babies aren't supposed to die. And I'm like, okay, but mine did, so now what?

SPEAKER_00 28:33

Like, and how do you understand why it happened? Yeah, there's no understanding, right? And that's something that's something you have to become comfortable with, yeah. Comfortable with being uncomfortable for sure.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

Yeah. Um I I have a qu like we have a question for you. Like we had made the decision to do the viewing. I honestly don't even really remember making the decision, it just kind of was. Um looking back now, would you still do it? No, absolutely. I wouldn't either.

SPEAKER_00 29:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:10

Yeah, there was without hesitation.

SPEAKER_00 29:12

There was no purpose for it.

SPEAKER_01 29:13

Yeah, it was terrible.

SPEAKER_00 29:15

Yeah, it was.

SPEAKER_01 29:16

It was terrible.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

But it was almost like when we were at the mortuary filling out all those paperworks, it was just a box that had to be checked. Like they put it upon us like something we needed to do.

SPEAKER_01 29:29

Yeah, it was like you'll have the building from this and this.

SPEAKER_00 29:31

Yeah. It wasn't it almost wasn't even an option to not do it.

SPEAKER_01 29:35

That's why I like I don't remember saying, yeah, we will do this. I distinctly remember saying in California, we will not do one.

SPEAKER_00 29:42

And we definitely did not have time to think about it. There was no through that whole process, there was no time to think about our decisions.

SPEAKER_01 29:50

Which part of me wonders if that's part of their business model.

SPEAKER_00 29:54

That's possible.

SPEAKER_01 29:55

Which is kind of gross to think about, you know. Yeah. Because you don't, you don't know. They're asking you all these different things, and you want the the best of the best for your baby or your you know, spouse or your parent, like whoever it is that you're going through. For us, it was our baby. So, okay, yeah, like he wouldn't tell me something I don't need. Like, of course, yes, of course I want that. Yes, of course. And you're not realizing anything, and then all of a sudden it's like, so is that gonna be cash or card? And you're like, Whoa, what? Like oh, it just is it was such a rush process, yeah. Yeah, I know without hesitation, would say zero percent when I do a viewing because we were there what three, maybe four hours. I think we I think the viewing was three, but we were four. They told us to go earlier.

SPEAKER_00 30:44

I was talking about the process of making the decisions. Oh my gosh, two, two to three, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 30:48

I don't know, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:49

A lot of like you have that little small it did it we say it's a long time, but it's really not a long time because it went by so fast, you don't have time to think about the decisions you're making. Right.

SPEAKER_01 31:04

No, it definitely felt like this was a terrible metaphor. It felt like we were on a conveyor belt. Yeah, and it was we better we have to hurry up because here's the end over here, and they've got the next one loaded already. Yes, correct. So, like, you know, you like I said, terrible metaphor to like visualize that, but that's what it felt like, and it was like, yeah, you guys are running out of time, we've got our next one lined up.

SPEAKER_00 31:27

Yes, you know, there's people in the lobby waiting to come.

SPEAKER_01 31:29

Yeah, and I mean, down to you think about the viewing, they had somebody next door at the same exact time of the and I'm like, you're telling me you couldn't have done this a little bit more private, like and I felt terrible for that family because they had a it was polar opposites. There's was a very old lady, yeah, and they're next door to this baby, yeah. And how you know they're coming in sad as they should. They've lost their loved one, and they are having to walk by our viewing room of seeing a baby because we had his picture up and things, and we had a slideshow playing. I mean, it was beautiful in the most beautiful way you could do it, right? But you feel terrible for this family over here who's walking by and having to see this, you know. And at the same time, I remember also being mad. They got a whole life with this person. I got seven months with mine. How dare they come in sad? They got, you know, however many 80 years. I don't know, I'm saying that, you know, it was a very old part again. You could see the picture. Um, I like they should not have done that. They really shouldn't have. I mean, I don't think any place should have more than one viewing going on. Definitely not. I mean, we were right next door to each other, like our door frame shared. It was and the times overlapped. I think ours was actually longer. I feel like we were the last ones to leave.

SPEAKER_00 32:59

I remember driving a lot of lingering people just lingering, waiting. We were almost felt like we were waiting for people to leave.

SPEAKER_01 33:06

Yeah. Well, and then you and I waited because we wanted to wait until the casket was closed, which is such a mind game and so terrible. Yeah. Um, all of that. But yeah, you have all those, and then you have to go, and I ended up ha sending my sister and your mom to do the flowers. Yeah. Because we were supposed to go right after that to the florist and pick out the flowers, and it was just so draining at the mortuary, and so terrible. I was like, I can't, I can't make any more decisions, I can't be out around people. Like, I can't. And and they understood that, you know, there was no pressure from our family at all. It was this is what we're here for, you know, and and like my sister was there, you know, the entire time with us, and so she knew the the color scheme, if that's what we want to say. Like, she knew we wanted the natural, like the neutral colors, you know. Um, and then they just really leaned on the florist as well and you know, explained the situation. Um, and our local florist did a beautiful job, but oh man, just so so many decisions. And then we have that viewing, and they had us go in early. Okay, you and I. They did say that our kids could go early too, but we knew that we needed to go because we hadn't seen him. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:33

And we were in the room before he they even brought him in the casket, right? No.

SPEAKER_01 34:37

Mm-mm. Okay. No, because I remember Jason saying he held my hand and he said, get ready, mom. And he said, When I open those doors, you're gonna want to fall over. And boy, was he right. Because it was a double door, and he opened it, and it felt like those cartoons when it's like trying to show you something, but it like it, you know, like it like zooms out, and I wanted to go to him, but I couldn't, I couldn't move, I was frozen, and I there was a coat rack on the left, and I just fell into that, and Jason was right there, and you know, I remember screaming, I remember you screaming, because now all of a sudden, because the last time I had seen him was doing CPR on him at home, and now all of a sudden my baby's in a gasket, and I know what that means, right? Like, that's not good, that means the end that you know, and he was, he was at the very end of it, and little by little, I mean, good thing we had that hour. I mean, honestly, our friends and family would have waited anyways. But little by little, step by step, you and I and Jason walked with us like half of the way, and then he stopped, and you and I kept going, and we eventually made it up to the casket, and then it was terrible.

SPEAKER_00 36:05

Yeah, I can't even describe what it felt like. It was his role.

SPEAKER_01 36:11

Yeah. I mean, he was beautiful, he really truly looked like he was napping, but obviously, too, as his mom, I was like, that's not how I would have done his hair. Oh, you know, like I mean, they did. They faux hawked it and stuff, but you could tell it wasn't his gel, you could tell it was glue, you could tell his eyelashes had makeup on, you know, like you could tell.

SPEAKER_00 36:34

Oh, absolutely, yeah. That was no baby is gonna wear makeup, right? So you could tell right away who it didn't look like him, right?

SPEAKER_01 36:43

Like it did, but it didn't.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:46

You know, like and then I he I touched his hand and he was so cold. And which is just so not him, I mean, but he he was so cold in that I I like dropped it, like it it really, really messed with me. Um because again, you know, I look back at my dad's situation, I didn't go up to my dad's casket, I didn't see my dad, I I couldn't. So this was really my first time face to face with somebody in a casket. Um and I had Jason open the entire thing. We had the the I don't know what they call it, like the split casket. And I had him open the entire thing because I wanted to make sure he had his shoes on.

unknown 37:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:37

And his little his little converse. Um, and he did. And he like he he looked beautiful. He looked like my baby, but he didn't look like my baby. He looked like he was sleeping, but I knew he wasn't, but I wanted to pick him up, I wanted to hold, and I wanted to run away, and I just wanted it to be over. And little did we know it was just starting, right? Like I just it was so so terrible. Um, and then you have people coming in, and this is why I say I wouldn't do it again. Like my worst day is uh this is I don't it almost felt like I was providing not that cash was entertainment, but like something for these people to come do, and there were certain groups that like were standing in the room like laughing and like talking amongst themselves, right? And like conversing with each other and laughing, and I remember thinking it was like a social event, yeah, yeah, at my baby's expense. Yeah, it was miserable, and I just remember thinking, like, this isn't funny, like what why are you why are you here? Why are you laughing?

SPEAKER_00 39:02

And you know, and I had run out at one time and ended up having to go throw up because it was just so much like it was a social it was like a social gathering, yeah, and it was a it was a pretty big room, and everyone just lined the walls, like there was nothing in the middle, no chairs or anything. Yeah, so it was it was a very uncomfortable time.

SPEAKER_01 39:23

Yeah, and then when we had a walk in with with Lincoln and Brindley, um, because we did not have them go early. Yeah, I didn't want them there longer than they had to be. They came with my sister. I mean, they came like 10 minutes early, right? Um, they came with my sister, and I it felt like as we walked up to the casket, um, you know, we had prepped them beforehand, what they were gonna see and all these things, you know, but eight and four, they don't know. Yeah, we don't know, right? As adults, and it felt like as we walked up, that like people just kept moving to the sides, you know, and just kind of letting us go up and things and having to have the kids talk through everything, and they had each brought his one of his favorite toys, and they put that in his casket. It just was so so terrible. Like, and I remember turning around and my seeing my best friend who I didn't know was going who I didn't know was going to um be there. And turning around and she was right there. Um just like being able to like collapse in her arms as well, right? Like, oh man. My sister couldn't go through. She didn't walk up to him until near the end. Um she finally was able to walk up with me.

SPEAKER_00 41:02

And it just was another reason why I wouldn't do it again was I wouldn't want to have to put people that didn't want to be there and didn't want to see that through that again as well. Because I know I remember having co-workers of mine come and specifically because they felt like they needed to. Yeah, they felt like they needed to, but at the same time, it was just so hard for everyone, and they were you could tell they didn't want to be there and they didn't want to have to go and see cash. Yeah, but they just did, and it was very so for us not wanting to do it, why should we have to put other people through that as well?

SPEAKER_01 41:39

Yeah, and you like yeah, I don't I don't really know why we why we do it. Um it's an interesting tradition, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 41:51

I don't I could understand someone who's in their uh older age and celebrating their life and lots of pictures of stuff they've done through their life.

SPEAKER_01 42:02

Yeah, but don't you think you should celebrate everyone's life?

SPEAKER_00 42:04

Yes, but that's what the funeral was for, not the viewing. I've I can understand a viewing for someone who's lived a long life for people to come and tell stories and sh see to me, I'm like that's still a funeral.

SPEAKER_01 42:20

We didn't have anyone talk at the viewing.

SPEAKER_00 42:21

Correct.

SPEAKER_01 42:22

I don't think most people do talk at a viewing.

SPEAKER_00 42:24

No, no.

SPEAKER_01 42:26

I think maybe you're I I feel like you're describing like an open casket funeral.

SPEAKER_00 42:32

But no, not a separate. Where viewing is more you mean like somebody just viewing is a social event, that's what the purpose of it is, which is crazy. It is, but I can understand why people would want to do it for their grandparents or their parents, because it's more relaxed environment to give families time to remember that person.

SPEAKER_01 43:01

But are you telling me that uh a view like in your mind, just so I can understand this, like you're at a viewing for I don't know, Grandma Jean, and you're telling me that Uncle Robert's walking through and he's just like, oh, Grandma Gene, one time like he just starts talking in the middle of it? Just that would be crazy.

SPEAKER_00 43:22

Other family member, not to the group as a whole, but no, no, no, no. It just you know, small conversations. I'm like, that's what you call like the drunk uncle at the small family conversations in smaller groups, okay, just a relaxed environment.

SPEAKER_01 43:38

I don't think anything about viewings is relaxing.

SPEAKER_00 43:41

I think it really depends on the age of the person, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_01 43:44

Yeah, for sure. I just don't, which is interesting because we didn't have a viewing for either one of your parents.

SPEAKER_00 43:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:51

So that's interesting, you know, where I'm sitting here and I'm like, no, I definitely don't, and yet both of mine were viewings.

SPEAKER_00 43:58

Well, both of my parents were cremated. So that's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01 44:00

Yeah, but people still have viewings for him beforehand.

unknown 44:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:03

I think that was the main reason why we didn't.

SPEAKER_01 44:05

Yeah. I just think that's interesting. Like somebody who's gone through it twice is like absolutely not in so you know, like very different um perspective on that. But I don't know. I just wish that we could figure out a way to let families grieve, to let them come to some kind of peace with it. I mean, and and I realize that that's dream thinking, right? Because it took years, and there's still days where I'm not at peace with it. But there's gotta be a better way than 24 hours.

SPEAKER_00 44:48

Yeah, let people process it the way they want to process it in their own time.

SPEAKER_01 44:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:53

And make those decisions in their own time.

SPEAKER_01 44:55

Because I also do think, you know, I'll I'll say this and then we can kind of wrap up, but it was a lot of pressure put on us to make decisions, to feel like we had to entertain, to answer questions, like everything from and and people didn't intentionally put that on us. I don't, I don't think, you know, I I genuinely don't feel that way. But we had we're we are natural entertainers. We like entertaining people, we like having them over, you know, for barbecues now or or things like that. I'm a fixer at heart. I couldn't fix a situation, like, no matter what I did. We couldn't entertain in the situation because we were shattered no matter how much we wanted to, like, but yet people were showing up at our house constantly. People were asking us questions constantly. People were like it just was so much pressure, and then people were uncomfortable, and so we had to make them feel comfortable, yeah, and that's not okay, and that's not fair to us, like or to anyone that's grieving, you know, whether it's a baby or a sibling or a parent or a grandparent. It is not the person who's grieving's job to make everyone else feel comfortable.

SPEAKER_00 46:36

With that, I'm gonna wrap it up.

SPEAKER_01 46:38

I guess so.

SPEAKER_00 46:38

I want to thank you guys for listening, watching. Um our social medias are gonna be Cash's Corner. You can find us on Instagram and Facebook. Yeah, double K, Cash's Corner. Um, reach out to us, send us a DM, send us a on Instagram or Facebook, and ask us questions. We'd love to answer your guys' questions on this podcast.

SPEAKER_01 47:03

And if you want to share your story, you know, what you went through, whether you were the parent, whether you were the child, whether you were the sibling, you know, um, we want to normalize emotion of grief and the cycle of grief, and we would love.

SPEAKER_00 47:23

And just create more support.

SPEAKER_01 47:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:25

A community of support.

SPEAKER_01 47:27

You know, and as we continue to talk through it, it will go from having to relive all of these for us to how are we doing now? And so, even if, you know, your story was years and years ago, we would still love to hear from you.

SPEAKER_00 47:44

So thank you guys for listening.